In what is definitely a first on this blog, my coverage of the Auctiva scare this week generated a anonymous tipster who told me that I forgot to mention the biggest problem with Auctiva. To be completely honest, I have never heard of the point this tipster brought up so I cannot say for sure if it is a true assessment of the situation or an outlandish conspiracy theory.
I can say that if it is true, it puts this whole virus scare this week into a new and interesting light.
Signed only, A Loyal Reader, here is the email I got:
I read your post on Auctiva today
(http://thewhineseller.com/2009/02/the-official-word-on-the-auctiva-virus-scare/)
and it seems like the most ironic and perhaps important point was omitted¦ eBay has been giving Auctiva several million dollars per year in funds as Auctiva cheats the eBay affiliate program (EPN).
That’s eBay Partner Network, their affiliate program, for those of you just tuning in. The email continues:
eBay has been directly supporting and helping grow Auctiva which in turn has been infecting buyers and tarnishing the reputation of sellers. Also, as eBay has removed some of Auctiva’s illegal affiliate links (although many still remain), Auctiva becomes more desperate to find ways to subsidize their free offering. Where else does a desperate dog turned other than other illegal activities such as installing click-tracking software?
When I first read about eBay helping Auctiva get virus free, I thought to myself that was nice of eBay. But if there is already history between the two, was that nice or just nessecary?
How does this theory work, though? Sadly, the tipster didn’t give me a valid email to reply to so I couldn’t ask follow up questions. If I had to guess. I would assume that it has something to do with embedding affiliate links in the Auctiva storefronts so that when buyers click through, Auctiva gets a cut but I am not sure that qualifies as illegal. Frankly, that seems like a really good idea to me and explains how Auctiva makes money outside of insurance sales which is something I have always wondered about.
Now, let me put on my doubting Thomas hat. Far be it from me to assume any company is above anything. I am a fan of both eBay and Auctiva but, heck, I am a fan of the almighty dollar and I assume any company will do anything to get money. But if Auctiva’s business depends almost entirely on eBay, why would they bite the hand that feeds them? And why would eBay stand for it when they shut down so many other people cheating the system? Wouldn’t they take away their approved provider status?
To me, it just doesn’t add up.
But, like so many things, there may be a grain of truth that is exaggerated into the conspiracy so I am not ready to totally discount it out of hand.
I turn this over to you. Have you heard of this theory before? Seen any evidence of it? Even if its new to you, does it seem plausible?
I would love to hear what you think!
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Auctiva seems likes its been around forever as a ‘partner’ to ebay. It makes sense for ebay to step in on the virus issue. When I see EPN links from auctiva I don’t click them.
Auctiva seems likes its been around forever as a ‘partner’ to ebay. It makes sense for ebay to step in on the virus issue. When I see EPN links from auctiva I don’t click them.
This is an interesting idea to ponder, as I have also long wondered how Auctiva was actually making money by providing all they do for free, funded only via the insurance (which I don’t use.) I’ll be watching for more updates on this, be sure to tweet them please.
It makes sense to me if EPN is one of the ways (include insurance, domain sales and the few other paid services on Auctiva) they are making money. It’s the “cheating” part I am having trouble with. I just cannot see eBay standing for it. Maybe I am being naive but eBay has plenty of service providers, they could cut Auctiva lose and it wouldn’t matter. To me, that says that whatever they are doing is on the up and up, but maybe I am not seeing the bigger picture.
This is an interesting idea to ponder, as I have also long wondered how Auctiva was actually making money by providing all they do for free, funded only via the insurance (which I don’t use.) I’ll be watching for more updates on this, be sure to tweet them please.
It makes sense to me if EPN is one of the ways (include insurance, domain sales and the few other paid services on Auctiva) they are making money. It’s the “cheating” part I am having trouble with. I just cannot see eBay standing for it. Maybe I am being naive but eBay has plenty of service providers, they could cut Auctiva lose and it wouldn’t matter. To me, that says that whatever they are doing is on the up and up, but maybe I am not seeing the bigger picture.
For me the most troubling part of it all has been the glaring silence from eBay about what happened. Are we all over reacting, or are they deliberately being quite because they’re still pondering a response?
For me the most troubling part of it all has been the glaring silence from eBay about what happened. Are we all over reacting, or are they deliberately being quite because they’re still pondering a response?
That is a good point, Katy. We would usually have had little note about it by now. I didn’t even think of that. Maybe they just don’t want to give them the free publicity after all the trouble they caused?
That is a good point, Katy. We would usually have had little note about it by now. I didn’t even think of that. Maybe they just don’t want to give them the free publicity after all the trouble they caused?
I wonder if the cool little “other listings by this seller” widget that are included with the Auctiva listing templates are passed through an EPN tracking link in a manner that is hard to detect? That would be a violation of the EPN TOS – specifically placing afflilate links on the eBay domain.
I wonder if the cool little “other listings by this seller” widget that are included with the Auctiva listing templates are passed through an EPN tracking link in a manner that is hard to detect? That would be a violation of the EPN TOS – specifically placing afflilate links on the eBay domain.
Hmm. Today i got my eBay account hacked for the first time ever, following immediately in the footsteps of the Auctiva debacle.
As an Auctiva user I have to say this is suspicious, if coincidental timing.
Hmm. Today i got my eBay account hacked for the first time ever, following immediately in the footsteps of the Auctiva debacle.
As an Auctiva user I have to say this is suspicious, if coincidental timing.
I’m an eBay affiliate as well – so what the “illegal” part of the email refers to is the fact that eBay changed their affiliate rules recently. You can do circular linking to generate $$. Seems as though Auctiva is still doing it and eBay is allowing them to get away with it. This is absolutely unfair to affiliate who’ve followed the rules.
I’m an eBay affiliate as well – so what the “illegal” part of the email refers to is the fact that eBay changed their affiliate rules recently. You can do circular linking to generate $$. Seems as though Auctiva is still doing it and eBay is allowing them to get away with it. This is absolutely unfair to affiliate who’ve followed the rules.
Hey, H. I just saw this post now.
I am under the impression that because of some of the abuses eBay saw with the ePN, they changed the rules. They “outlawed” some of the “round tripping” that some companies were doing.
I don’t know if anybody is still doing it, but I was told by another vendor that eBay is planning to clamp down on these things that break the rules. I’m under the impression that Auctiva is not going to be allowed to “get away with it” anymore.
To me, it raises the larger question of how will Auctiva make the money it needs to make to improve their system and employ people if they are no longer making the huge amounts of money they were making from ePN.
I always assumed that Auctiva made its money off of insurance sales and the few little extras they sell like domain names but I realize now that was probably naive of me. I wonder if this cracking down is why they added their own e-commerce stores?
I still am not convinced this is 100% true but it will be interesting to see if they come out with a ton of new money makers right after eBay cracks down on the EPN.
Hey, H. I just saw this post now.
I am under the impression that because of some of the abuses eBay saw with the ePN, they changed the rules. They “outlawed” some of the “round tripping” that some companies were doing.
I don’t know if anybody is still doing it, but I was told by another vendor that eBay is planning to clamp down on these things that break the rules. I’m under the impression that Auctiva is not going to be allowed to “get away with it” anymore.
To me, it raises the larger question of how will Auctiva make the money it needs to make to improve their system and employ people if they are no longer making the huge amounts of money they were making from ePN.
I always assumed that Auctiva made its money off of insurance sales and the few little extras they sell like domain names but I realize now that was probably naive of me. I wonder if this cracking down is why they added their own e-commerce stores?
I still am not convinced this is 100% true but it will be interesting to see if they come out with a ton of new money makers right after eBay cracks down on the EPN.
Hi, I think I have some insight. Auctiva also owns auctionsniper.com which is a eBay sniper service. auctionsniper.com is a pay service and they charge a percentage of what of the item won sells for. Also, auctionsniper.com use to have has ton of ePN links in their pages but I think eBay made them remove them. I heard eBay will soon make Auctiva remove all the click-back links (which generate most of their revenue). My guess is once this goes into effect that Auctiva will have to start charging for their auction management service. I think eBay is a little afraid of Auctiva because it is getting so large and has some many sellers, that they dont want turn them into competition. Therefore, they often bend and break the rules for them, until someone spills the beans and outrage ensues.
Hi, I think I have some insight. Auctiva also owns auctionsniper.com which is a eBay sniper service. auctionsniper.com is a pay service and they charge a percentage of what of the item won sells for. Also, auctionsniper.com use to have has ton of ePN links in their pages but I think eBay made them remove them. I heard eBay will soon make Auctiva remove all the click-back links (which generate most of their revenue). My guess is once this goes into effect that Auctiva will have to start charging for their auction management service. I think eBay is a little afraid of Auctiva because it is getting so large and has some many sellers, that they dont want turn them into competition. Therefore, they often bend and break the rules for them, until someone spills the beans and outrage ensues.
The “scam” we were running was that people clicking in the Auctiva Store Window (an optional listing widget provided by us) were getting sent to the Auctiva Stores which just showed sellers' ebay items. Links in those stores took people back to eBay with our affiliate link. eBay has since changed it's policy so that we get no money from that since the users originated from eBay. While I agree that we weren't adding new buyers to the ecosystem, we were adding value and eBay should have continued to fund our ventures if only in a reduced fashion. That change to the affiliate program drastically affected our income and we have since had to charging for Auctiva.
As for the virus fiasco:
We were hacked through a vulnerability in a piece of 3rd party technology that was out of date. We tracked the source to China but there was little we could do aside from plug the hole and deal with the PR crisis. The situation put the whole company on a security kick and many of us worked prolonged overtime to make sure that Auctiva's future was sound. All our products are virus free now, twice as secure, and you shouldn't fear when using them.
I just came across your website. It is truly excellent and very valuable resource in today’s economy.
well friend But that is a conspiracy theory for another time. … Auctiva Scam Where else can you go by deartfuldodger. Sites Like Etsy. Photo by Sarabbit!